Comments for Bridges and Tangents

Comment on The scandal of Christian uniqueness by Fr Stephen Wang

Fr Stephen Wang — Wed, 19 Jun 2013 22:12:29 +0000

The key passage for me on this question of people coming to know Him in ways unknown to us is this from the Catechism, Para 1260: “Since Christ died for all, and since all men are in fact called to one and the same destiny, which is divine, we must hold that the Holy Spirit offers to all the possibility of being made partakers, in a way known to God, of the Paschal mystery.” [GS 22 § 5; cf. LG 16; AG 7] Every man who is ignorant of the Gospel of Christ and of his Church, but seeks the truth and does the will of God in accordance with his understanding of it, can be saved. It may be supposed that such persons would have desired Baptism explicitly if they had known its necessity.”

Comment on The scandal of Christian uniqueness by Fr Thomas Crean

Fr Thomas Crean — Wed, 19 Jun 2013 18:44:21 +0000

I agree that Christ died for all, and since I also think that coming to know Him is necessary for salvation, it follows that God will give everyone a chance to come to know Him, even if it is in some way known only to Himself.

Comment on The scandal of Christian uniqueness by Fr Thomas Crean

Fr Thomas Crean — Wed, 19 Jun 2013 18:42:06 +0000

I agree that paragraph 12 by itself would leave this possibility open, as it doesn’t distinguish between actual grace and sanctifying grace. But paragraph 7 defines faith as “the acceptance of the truth revealed by the One and Triune God”. It would be strange to say that one can nevertheless have faith even if one denies the Trinity.

The modern catechism likewise says that ‘believing in Jesus Christ and in the One who sent him for our salvation is necessary for obtaining that salvation’ (CCC 161). Can someone who doesn’t acknowledge Christ as Lord be said to believe in Him?

Clearest of all, I would say, against any theory of anonymous Christianity is the Council of Florence, which of course defined that ‘Jews and pagans’ don’t obtain salvation if they remain as they are until death. The phrase ‘Jews and pagans’ was intended to denote all adult human beings who don’t acknowledge Christ.

Comment on What British people say. What they really mean. What other people really understand. by Fr Stephen Wang

Fr Stephen Wang — Wed, 19 Jun 2013 16:59:33 +0000

I like the phrase ‘air-kiss dinner invitation’!

Comment on What British people say. What they really mean. What other people really understand. by sdwlig

sdwlig — Wed, 19 Jun 2013 10:15:28 +0000

Except for dinner, those mean the same for Americans / American English. We won’t often say “quite good” or “with the greatest respect”, but we’d recognize them and it wouldn’t be too weird to use them. Probably some in the Northeast would use that kind of air-kiss dinner invitation, but for most, if you invite someone to dinner, you better be ready to be accepted.

Comment on The scandal of Christian uniqueness by mags

mags — Wed, 19 Jun 2013 01:43:58 +0000

Paragraph 12;

‘Furthermore, the salvific action of Jesus Christ, with and through his Spirit, extends beyond the visible boundaries of the Church to all humanity.’

“All this holds true not only for Christians but also for all men of good will in whose hearts grace is active invisibly.’

I think it is Jesus Christ’ in His dying for All regardless of anything . . . even for those ‘prior to messianic times’ even for those without knowledge that makes Jesus Christ the unique saviour.

Comment on The scandal of Christian uniqueness by mags

mags — Wed, 19 Jun 2013 00:38:14 +0000

Im sorry I just do not believe that for e.g. a baby who does not yet know faith in Christ, or for a child, or anyone else for that matter that has not had the privilege of a practising Christian upbringing – that Christ did not die for them too. He died for the forgiveness of All our sins, regardless – else regarding All distinctions.

It is my experience that as we slowly grow more and more aware in conscience with age, we all have the capacity to become truly repentant for our sins, even as a child we repent in tears and therefore in our soul for things we feel bad about, many without the privilege of being brought up even knowing about the Sacrament of Reconciliation, and many brought up without even knowing Christ.

Christ died for us All. And whilst He tells us to go out and baptise all nations, he doesn’t say I Am not dying for the ones you have failed to reach. He also talks about every creature, not just humans. When any being lives in Love and Spirit, they live in God our Heavenly Father.

The richness of falling in Love in Christ however is to discover/glimpse/grow in the Kingdom of Heaven within life, before we change realms, and who wouldn’t Jesus want us to share that with, and who wouldn’t we we want to share that with, so that they too might know it.

Comment on The scandal of Christian uniqueness by Fr Stephen Wang

Fr Stephen Wang — Tue, 18 Jun 2013 22:30:01 +0000

Thanks for the comment. You are right about this important distinction in para 7. I still think that para 12 leaves open this possibility of salvation ‘without explicit knowledge of Christ’ (but I wouldn’t say ‘without faith’).

Comment on The scandal of Christian uniqueness by Fr Thomas Crean

Fr Thomas Crean — Tue, 18 Jun 2013 19:29:03 +0000

Actually, I think Dominus Iesus doesn’t leave open the possibility of salvation without the explicit knowledge of Christ. Paragraph 7 makes a clear distinction between the gift of faith in the one and triune God, exercised in the Christian religion, and belief, found in other religions as a result of human tradition or endeavour. This needs to be read in conjunction with Vatican I’s teaching that without faith no one can be justified.

Comment on Fasting is suddenly fashionable by Simon Rockley

Simon Rockley — Mon, 17 Jun 2013 17:16:42 +0000

I am seriously considering giving the 5:2 Diet a try. I am hopeless at the discipline of cutting out things on a medium/long term basis, so perhaps this will ‘ease’ me in to the concept of cutting certain things and might lead me to be able to do so on a longer term.
Here goes!